Build a MM – Product – Sails

Summary

This post contains sail prices and will be updated as new data arrives.

The products identified thus far are:

  • Velas

Velas Sails

vamsails@vamsails.com
https://www.vamsails.com
Payment: PalPal
Transportation: 12€ ($13)
Transportation Time: 2 weeks

These sails were identified by Greg Norris, MM Class Secretary, USA.

SAIL A 45€ (about $47)
SAIL B  AND C 35€
SAIL D AND E  30€
GOOSENECK COMPLETED 37€
BACKSTAY CRANE CARBON 9€

(On March 31, 2017 when this data was received the Euro was trading at about $1.07/Euros)

 

Building a MM – Products – Tx and Rx

Receiver

HobbyKing OrangeRx R610V2 Lite DSM2 Compatible 6CH 2.4GHz Receiver w/CPPM

View the product details at the HobbyKing website and then bu
y it from a USA source that you find searching.

A typical price is $12.00 including shipping and a few day delivery.

Transmitter

HobbyKing OrangeRx T-SIX 2.4GHz DSM2 Compatible 6CH Transmitter w/10 Model Memory and 3-Pos Switch (Mode 2)

View the product details at the HobbyKing website and then bu
y it from a USA source that you find searching.

Pricing varies widely but it appears that it can be found for under $100. Watch the delivery time information as it can vary widely, ie, up to two months (likely coming from Hong Kong).

Alternative Tx

There are many transmitter choices on the Internet. You want one that is 2.4 GHz, DSMX/DSM2 compatible. An obvious choice is a radio by Spektrum or Futaba. But there are selections on the Internet at very low prices. Ideally you also want your Tx to support Dual Rate/Exponential. This function is used with the rudder to improve direction control.

I found this radio (Tx and Rx) on the BangGood.com website during a casual browsing: (THE QUALITY OF THIS PRODUCT IS NOT KNOWN). Price about $44 with free shipping.

FlySky FS-i6 2.4G 6CH AFHDS RC Transmitter With FS-iA6B Receiver

 

Building a MM – PMYC Members

This page holds the information and photos of the MM building experience of our members. The data is grouped by member.

All contributions to our MM building experience appear in separate posts labeled appropriately but all sharing the “Building an MM” post category.

The members whom have or will be contributing to this post are:

Bill Brown – coming soon

 

Jerry Robertson – coming soon

 

============================

Jerry Walker

Running rigging (sheets)

Source: Walmart.

This product worked in an outstanding manner on my Victoria. I will use it again. It is a very pliable 15# weave.

 

 

 

Sails

Jim Bankson Sails for use on the Micro Magic
Jim Bankson Sails for use on the Micro Magic

The view has been expressed to us that the MM kit sails are not of a good shape but that they work. PMYC has standardized on the kit sails as a contribution to keeping the price of the boat in the water to a minim
um. The Kit sails are flat panel, meaning they are made of one piece of material. Jim Bankson a past member of PMYC has offered to make us flat panel sails – presumably of a higher quality. The images below are close-up images of the three suits of sails he made for us for evaluation. At this time he is offering to make us these sails for $40 per suit – material of our choosing.

 

Spinnaker Cloth Sail Material. Note the little squares.
Spinnaker Cloth Sail Material. Note the little squares.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

505 - smooth, shiney surface on one side; rough surface of fibers on other side
505 – smooth, shiney surface on one side

 

 

 

 

 

 

505 - Rough surface of fibers on other side
505 – Rough surface of fibers embedded in the material on other side

 

 

 

 

 

 

Mylar - Smooth on both sides
Mylar – Smooth on both sides

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Building a MM – Email Exchange with Mike Eades & Greg Norris, Late March, 2017

This post, dated March 27, 2017, contains two email exchanges between Jerry Walker and Mike Eades of the West Valley RC Mariners (WVRCM) regarding the building of a MM.

The writer of each email is identified.

Jerry to Mike

We still have just one MM on the pond here in Tucson. Each perso
n who sails it for the first time loves it. It performs surprisingly well against the Victorias.

We have two boats under construction (one by Jerry Robertson – he has communicated with you). We are working up to an order for seven kits from GraupnerUSA in time for an anticipated mid-May avail
ability.

We are finding with the two kits we have that the mast diameter is a lot closer to 6mm than to 5mm. Thus, mast fittings aren’t fitting. In general, switching to a thicker mast is problematic, especially for newbies.

Pima Micro yacht Club Micro Magic serving as a tug to get its own box top to the shore
The venerable Micro Magic succeeds in moving its own kit box top to the shore.

The issue with the rear corner mis match between the deck and hull is disturbing, but not an insurmountable problem.

We are finding that with the one boat we have on the pond, built in 2009, that the mast is 5mm. We do not have stays on this boat. It appears to us that in a 5 – 10 mph breeze that the boat shows much more inclination to heal than to bend its mast. What is your thought?

In the list of Graupner parts I see the refererence to servo sizes. It’s interesting to note the significant difference in performance between the base recommendation (C 261) and the C 3341) Is there a general agreement in the USA of which servos to use? Or, at least their capacity.

Of our two kits, one has a main sail that looks decent. The other one has significant wrinkles near the tack. It would not seem possible with a flat sail for that condition to arise. Presumably, this is the basis for your recommendation in your article to replace the sails right away. We are going to investigate the feasibility of making our own sails. We have a member who became quite proficient at making good performing Victoria sails.

I look forward to hearing from you. We are very excited about our MM decision. And, our website is evolving to reflect that excitement.

Jerry Walker

Mike to Jerry

I am glad to hear your club’s enthusiasm for the Micro Magic is increasing!

I will comment on those of your questions that I can answer however I have not built a MM from recent kits, only the ARTR version. Greg Norris built from a V2 kit and wrote it up for an article in the MM feature in the next issue of Model Yachting. I have copied him on this so that he can add his thoughts.

I did not encounter mast diameter problems with the ARTR version. My original MM had a 5 mm OD mast and I used it successfully without shrouds so I don’t believe they are necessary on any MM.

I don’t know of anyone who uses Graupner servos in the US. I used to use the Hitec HS485HB as sail winch and HS65HB for the rudder. However I encountered some strange problems with the HS485HB in which the servo would suddenly jump about 20 degrees and stay there requiring re-centering of the servo arm. Neither Hitec or I could explain this and I eventually went to the Futaba S3010 sail winch. This required drilling new holes in the servo arm to fit the Futaba spline but after modification this servo has worked well for several years without problems.

There seem to have been some issues with sails in recent kits and ARTR versions, not as well made as the original MM kit sails. While they perform fairly well they don’t look good. I made some sets of single panel sails for my original MM which were quite successful but for my Champ Spec MM built by Mike Weston, UK I bought 5 sets of Graphite sails from John Tushingham. I have since replaced the A suit, due to wear, with an A suit from Catsails UK which are excellent and reasonable priced. Several of our club members have bought from Catsails who give great service.

Hope this is helpful?

I look forward to hearing how your fleet develops and hope to see some of you sailing with us here in Phoenix.

Mike

Jerry Followup to Mike

What is the meaning of “Champ spec MM”?

Jerry

Mike to Jerry

Mike Weston in the UK used to sell and build MM kits and based on his and John Tushingham’s experience developed  what he called his “Champ Spec” configuration and built and sold many MM’s to this spec. I bought one to see what he did so that our club members could modify their kit builds to conform to his spec. There is nothing radical but he incorporated several minor refinements that improved the room in the cockpit, ease of locating the battery further aft for higher winds and brought the main sheet adjustment down into the rear cockpit in addition to using the preferred Mark I fin and rudder and Mark II bulb, set back so that the front edge of the fin was 25 mm from the forward end of the bulb. All in all it produced a well-balanced boat easy to adjust and sail. In the article I did on the first ARTR MM I bought from Germany I compared the features of the ARTR version side by side with my Champ Spec boat on which the ARTR design was based.

Mike

Jerry to Mike

Using kit parts should we be moving the fin location on the bulb?

We have concluded that we want to get the main sheet away from the hatch cover. One idea is to place a tube at the forward edge of the cockpit that extends just a little above the hatch cover. Thus, the sheet clears the cover and has all of its effect on the boom to be (almost) horizontal.

Perhaps you could find a few minutes to send me a pic of the component arrangement in the boat. Perhaps we can take advantage of your ideas.

On our Victorias we typically made a flat platform that one could attach the battery to anywhere on its length (Velcro) and have it engage the rudder post. Thus, the battery could be moved almost to the stern. We use four and five cell flat battery paks. Are you doing something similar?

Jerry

______________________

Mike to Jerry

Awaiting Mikes response.

____________________

Greg Norris Jumped in

In Mike’s first response, he indicated that he had forwarded my email to Greg Norris, the Micro Magic Class Secretary. Here is his response.

I’m happy that you’re making progress!

I liked the new kit well, and I wrote an article about putting it together.  That article will be out in the early summer edition of Model Yachting.  In the meantime, please call me with any assembly questions.  In particular, if you are assembling any carbon edition kits, please give me a call for sure.

To your specific questions:

Masts:

Graupner has been very slowly but steadily improving the kit.  The one I put together had a 6mm mast with a tapered top.  The mast was thick walled, and much heavier than I would ever use.  I suggest using either an older kit 5mm mast or a ~ 6mm SkyShark 2P.  The latter have been the usual choice for MMs for years.  They are nice.  The 5mm old kit masts are also fine.  The current European champion uses them.

Both are easily available: SkyShark 2P – https://goodwinds.com  They are a reliable supplier.

5mm old kit masts – I have some of these on order.  Should be here in a week or two at the latest.  I’ll be out of town from tomorrow through 4/9.  They should be here when I return, and I can send you one.

Sails:

I agree with Mike.  I would not race with the current kit sails.  I don’t have current websites for Graphite or Cat, and I wasn’t aware that Graphite is currently making MM sails. (Mike will know the answer to the last question and have the CAT website.)  The other common choice is VAM (vamsails.com).  These are sails made in Spain by a guy named Victor Izquerido.  They are the most common European sails.  The prices are competitive with everybody else, even including shipping.  Victor is very reliable and quick.  I think that Cat and VAM are both very good ways to go.

Servos:

I agree exactly with Mike, though we’ve had no problems with the HiTec 485HB.  But given Mike’s experience, it makes sense to go with the Futaba sail servo.  I buy all of my servos from ServoCity.  I’ve found them to be reliable.  (www.servocity.com).

Hope that this helps!

Greg Norris, 970 210-4112

Building a MM – Model Yachting Magazine

 Model Yachting Magazine

Issue 159, 2010, Pat Buttersworth

This article contains hints and ideas for building. This document was scanned from the magazine. It’s images are difficult to interpret. But, if used with the Graupner instructions the images become more understandable.

Micro Magic Build Model Yachting #159

Issue #162 (entire issue), Winter 2010

The entire magazine was devoted to the Micro Magic. For the near future, you will have to find a Club member who has the magazine.

Summer 2017 Issue – Entire Mag.

Coming soon to your mail box if you are an AMYA Member.

Building a Micro Magic – Purchase Sources

There are three sources for the Micro Magic. In each site, search for “micro magic”. I have asked Bill Brown to fill in the details.

Graupner USA – https://www.graupnerusa.com/. The website indicates that the MM is out of stock with availability now set for mid-May. As of now (Mar. 4, 2010) GraupnerUSA has indicated that they would extend PMYC a Club discount. We’ll see when mid-May comes nearer.

Tower Hobbies – http://towerhobbies.com/

Note: Tower Hobbies currently (Feb. 15, 2017) shows this item Temp. Unavailable.

The GraupnerUSA sales rep told me (approx. late Feb, 2010) that Tower Hobbies gets their product from GraupnerUSA. So, presumeably the MM will be available from both sites at about the same time.

Cornwall  Model Boats – http://www.cornwallmodelboats.co.uk/ Bill Brown just paid $203 for a MM kit including UPS shipping. Cornwall site indicates no kits in stock with the following note:

“Once Again dealing direct with Graupner – Orders every 2 weeks.”

Building a MM – Email exchange between Jerry Robertson & Mike Eades of Litchfield Park

Mike is a well known model yacht racer of multiple classes, including the Micro Magic. This post contains the content of Jerry’s email exchanges with Mike over the past six months. Jerry R. approved of me adding this exchange to our website.

Jerry wrote to Mike:

1.  Sail rigs.  How many do you use and which ones?
2.  The maker of the sails you are using?
3.  Does each rig have its own mast and booms?
4.  Does each rig mean both jib and main?

Mike responded:

A great weekend of MM sailing in Colorado! If you ever get a chance to sail at an event with the Azura MYC in Paonia, CO do not miss it!

Sorry about the missing attachment I do that a lot. Here it is! (Jerry W. – I’m not sure we have the attachment here. If not i will add it later.)

Either the Graupner.DE site or the RCZeilen.NL site is a viable supplier. I ordered a RTR MM from the Graupner site and it came with no problems. I have ordered some parts from the Dutch site, easy order process but they have not yet arrived. I expect them some time this week.

As to your questions below:

  1. I have 5 sail rigs A-E. A rig is used most of the time but I have used A, B, C & once a D rig in US events and once or twice D & E rigs on our home pond in a good blow. I got the full set for competing in Europe where winds are typically much stronger. I sailed there once with a borrowed boat starting out in D rig and going to E rig. The boat behaves fantastically planing downwind in E rig! Up to you how many to get but you will get most use out of the A rig.
  2. For my latest and best boat I got a set of 5 “Graphite” rig kits from John Tushingham, UK who loaned me the boat I mentioned and I sailed with him  and Mike Weston, the builder of my boat, in Europe twice. He builds very nice rigs with some excellent innovative components but he is not a good supplier in general. Several skippers got frustrated with his unresponsiveness to emails etc. I have attached copies of his rigging plans for your information which are helpful guides to see how to build your own rigs. You can duplicate most all of his components from other suppliers with a bit of time and expense. I recently got a new suit of A rig sails from Catsails, UK, http://www.catsails.co.uk/micromagic.html. Nigel and Sue brown are excellent attentive suppliers. I especially like the fact that they will build an A rig suit out of Icarex which is polycarbonate-coated rip stop polyester in very lightweight cloth that does not crease easily and is soft enough to reform the shape with very light wind shifts whereas Trispi or Mylar used by other sail makers is too stiff for an A rig in my opinion.
  3. All my rigs are complete with spar, gooseneck and booms for quick rig changes.
  4. Each rig consist of jib and main.

Hope this is helpful?

Jerry wrote:

Mike
The need to have and change so many rigs has really cooled my interest in MM.  Because of that I am going to pass on the MM project.  Such a shame because It is a beautiful little boat and I was really looking forward to sailing with you and the other fast guys out your way.  Thanks so much for your effort to bring me up to speed with all the info you have sent.  If the rules ever change to allow only one or maybe two rigs I could go with that.  An unlikely change I am sure.
Thanks again,
Jerry

 

Mike responded:

That’s too bad, most skippers have only the A rig but a set of 3 rigs would cover over 90% of the likely sailing opportunities.

Building a MM – Associated Websites

Magic Micro Website

Step-by_Step Instructions

http://usa.magicmicro.org/f/public/1407421893_27_FT0_micro_magic_mk_ii_racing_step_by_step_assembly_instructions.pdf

Micro Magic Parts List

http://usa.magicmicro.org/f/public/1407421893_27_FT0_micro_magic_mk_ii_parts_list_with_pictures.pdf

 

Micro Magic International

http://micromagic.info/

The British Class website is at: http://magicmicro.org/news.php.

Graupner

Graupner website: https://www.graupnerusa.com/Graupner-Micro-Magic-Race-Carbon-V2-Kit.html

Contact GraupnerUSA – E-mail:

Micro Magic USA

United States Class Association: http://usa.magicmicro.org/news.php

Micro Magic UK

The British Class website is at: http://magicmicro.org/news.php.